Should I Buy ...?

I am a Website x5 Pro user who, for one reason or another, is looking for a new website design software. I still need a WYSWYG for design because I am NOT a programmer. I am a graphic designer who very occasionally designs a site for someone.

If I purchase PineGrow will I be a happy designer?
Also can I install it on my 2 computers (for the one fee) so that I may design at home or on the go. I don’t want to have to be on the computer at home to work on my projects.

Any advice welcome. Am considering a purchase … trying to decide today.

I think you need to have relatively good coding knowledge to get around with pg.
Download the trial and take it for a ride. See for yourself.

Thanks … can you recommend something else? A software like I need?

Years ago I used Dreamweaver. Been a few years though.


Give Bootstrap Studio a try. Coding knowledge still helps, but the learning curve is less steep.

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Here is a new kid on the block I’ve found, which claims to be especially made for designers.
Like all visual-only tools it has its limitations. I have not found global text styles for example and it is cloud based, but you can check it out.

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This is why i came to PG. I’m not particularly interested in the details of the code either, and have been looking for a visual design environment that was up to modern standards. Looked at W5 and a dozen others, but nothing seems to have the power and features i want.

TemplateToaster “seemed” to until i tried using it (I found Artisteer first and was looking for what replaced it) but, neither of these really allow you to BUILD anything. They seem like they need you to already have the elements in place (from some other source) so that you can make them Artist’ier or “Toast” them to your liking (hence the nameage, i suppose).

MobileRise probably came closest, but it is so, SO limited in what you can do with it… and it’s not really an “offline” program since it forces you to log into your mobilerise acct in order to use the product!

So here i sit with openElement, quick 'n easy website builder and NetObjects left sitting next to pinegrow.

There is NO comparison, the rest look dated and sloppy with their various attempts at responsive design and proprietary code.

The promise of Bootstrap Studio seems far more solid than TT did, and I like how the UX is very much like that of PG in terms of what’s available to the user, only with less to worry about.

As i’m not interested in WP or any of that, it would seem like a good place to start.

But I still want to have a master page, to be able to utilize CSS grids (since in think that’s where this is all going), and would like the ability to use other frameworks besides just bootstrap.

Bootstrap is a better work around than most using tables or a cluge of

statements to simulate a responsive design, but it seems to be worth investing some extra learning curve into something like PG so that i’m not limiting myself.

I wish there were a true visual editor on the market, but there just isn’t one… as far as i can tell.

Online editors seem to be all the rage these days and apparently killed Adobe Muse along with a number of other “installed” programs, in favor of online building block type services.

Call me old school, but i like to have my work right here on my desktop, not atomized in the ether. If my computer crashes and I have to reinstall from backups, then I know how to do that. If the cloud evaporates, then I’m left with only memories.

Give me a desktop program installed on my local machine any day of the week.

The internet is for communication, not for working in.

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Thank you for taking time to share that useful information with me. I definitely prefer to have full control over my projects … meaning having it all in my local drive and working in a program that isn’t inn a cloud!

I started out with a design program by Symantec in the 90s, then Frontage, dreamweaver, & most recent was Website X5 Pro.

I haven’t done the trial of PG yet. I will do that a soon as I have time to try it out without wasting the trial time.

Freon what you’ve said … I an getting that you think PG and or Bootstrap Studio would be close as I can get, these days, to what I’m looking for in a website design software. Right?

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I went from Frontpage to NetObjects because dreamweaver was too expensive… but netobjects seems to have stalled in place now, and it was considerably more difficult to use than FrontPage.

My PG trial period has already ended, and the learning curve for PG is steeper than 7 days … it really should be 30.

HI there, the devs are pretty flexible @droidgoo, just drop them a line and ask them if they could extend your trial/ run it again, they will probably help you out. And you probably do have a point as PG now does so much more than it used to! but it is still on a 7 day trial, as it always has been.
But it can do so much more now that it certainly takes a while to get to grips with.

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I agree with you and also design and develop locally. Here is an interesting article by the way: the design tool dilemma in the digital age.

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Besides from been a cloud solution I think webflow might work for you.

@JH34 Jenn… 100% WYSIWYG… Xara Designer Pro X.

I’m waiting for PG Pro to go on sale around Thanksgiving for 50% off and then I will pick up a 1 year subscription.

I have Xara, Mobirise, Bootstrap Studio, and Visual Studio Code to play with until then. I also have Pinegrow Theme Converter to play with and learn.

My only other suggestions would be Wix or Weebly.

Xara is like W5 in that it basically forces you to create a separate layout for each media query … this is not what “responsive” means to me.

Better to start from first principles of CSS grid and work from there… that’s why pinegrow seems like the right fit for me with it’s CSS grid editor to help visualize.

now i just need to find some nav menus i can drop into my master page grid.

You are 100% correct. Xara is ‘adaptive’ and not ‘responsive’ and is also not mobile-first. But it is truly 100% WYSIWYG in every browser with 0% coding.

And I might venture to say that its built in graphics editor is on par with Photoshop and can import PSDs.

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I’m currently using CSS Grid in BSS and VSCode directly without a CSS Grid editor. I suppose having an editor might be nice.

You can use Flex inside CSS Grid and don’t have to reinvent the wheel unless you really want to.

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BSS was my 2nd choice, but the grid visulaizaion and abilty to create a master page puts PG ahead.

Neither one seems to be out ahead on other CSS management tools, but PG at least gives you some visual indications when “you are doing it wrong”.

As a newbie, I’ll take all the help I can get.

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O.K… ya’ got to me, but I’m still waiting for the 50% off License 'round Thanksgiving. So I bought a PRO subscription for a couple of months.

Should give you a commission or something, but I guess word-of-mouth is one of the best ways of saying thanks to the devs.

Now I’m active on three forums… what a mess!

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you should make a website about it. :wink:

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I’ve had to drop out of one forum so I can even think straight.

But, what I have resolved myself to doing is using only CSS Grid (and Flex) instead of BS for placement.

Now that might make an interesting video, but I have two client sites to do, and then I want some for me!

(note to self: I need to find time for my two new PG Lifetime toys.)

*** I’m schwamped!!! :joy: ***

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