Now it has happened: the final version of Dreamweaver 2017 is launched and it is the expected disaster.
i can’t believe it, but a lot of functions doesn’t work, eg SCSS edit in html or the live preview!
This could be the chance for PG, but for that the interface design must become clearly better and it must happen fast.
Now I program the Frontend with chrome, with the live Sass and Quick Source this is solved extremely well.
Unfortunately, Compass is not supported.
There are certainly high hopes for an improved UI / UX in the next version (ver3) of Pinegrow. Time will tell how that unfolds in the next version. But yes an improved UI / UX along with improved and added features will assist in expanding Pinegrow’s user base.
In the meantime, I am sure regardless that Adobe will continue to lose users to the plethora of product alternatives across their own entire product spectrum.
For selfish reasons I hope the individuals that use dreamweaver, stay with dreamweaver and Pinegrow stays as a hidden gem of web design.
But I think its unrealistic to expect major changes to happen fast in terms of the interface - if they start redesigning the software to be more user friendly for dreamweaver users, surely they would need to rewrite much of the software? or am I over estimating how much work would be involved?
I desire for Pinegrow to have as many paying customers as possible. It will only enhance and propel the platforms ability moving forward and benefit the entire Pinegrow community in the long run. So yeah don’t be selfish, I want this Pine to Grow as much as possible, we will all benefit.
Pinegrow is built using NW.js , so it’s UI interface is based on common web standards HTML/CSS/JS/etc. Thus its pretty simple (relatively speaking) to rethink and redesign the UI. However with good UI / UX you really have to understand the best way for users to input and interact with information, it’s structure, organization and segmentation with in the app.
@Matjaž and the Pinegrow team have an overall better vision than Adobe IMHO. I have a tremendous amount of respect and admiration for @Matjaž and what he has thus far accomplished, the Pinegrow story is truly amazing.
Somewhat ironically, given Dreamweaver has Brackets and other facets now rolled into it, Dreamweaver is seemingly trying to be more like Pinegrow actually. Perhaps that’s totally inadvertently but it’s rather amusing just the same. I am sure they are well aware of Pinegrow and it’s powerful features over there.
Pinegrow will only get better.
One helpful change would be to get rid of unwanted buttons and fields. One thing I hate about DW is the extreme visual clutter of showing everything, including the irrelevant.
Example: CSS Text:
Text sections with subsections for Character, Paragraph, etc. Click single arrow to reveal / conceal active settings. Click double arrow to reveal / conceal all settings.
All you see is what is actually used. If you want to add something, click on the double arrow, enter the desired setting, click on the double arrow to collapse it to show only active settings.
No clutter, but the settings are all instantly available.
Not sure how Dreamweaver has advanced since this thread was post, don’t use it.
But I see the folks at DMXzone maker of various Dreamweaver extensions, seem to have decided to make their own application, called Wappler [ blog with info ].
I just happened across it mentioned on the Adobe forums, it’s said to be in private beta currently. Not sure if it will really be competitive against Pinegrow’s features or price based upon the little which is known and discussed about it presently.
But it’s interesting more people are entering the market with desktop apps vs cloud based offerings. Still pretty vague what it will offer regarding overall features or workflow, no word on if its gonna be perpetual or what the pricing will be.
I guess they figured there are enough people disgruntled with the Dreamweaver development and Adobe in general, so why not create their own app. I suspect they based it largely upon Dreamweaver user feedback and the findings from their own extensions over the years.
To sum it up though … 
are you going to try it?
If they release a public beta or trial I will test it merely to review the UI / UX, workflow etc. As for purchasing it, well thats based on features, capabilities and redundancy with Pinegrow. But if it is based upon a perpetual license and has fair and decent pricing, I may consider it. Without those two factors though, no chance.
Turn coat… Pinegrow Forever!!!
Turncoat? Come on not at all, I just like studying UI / UX and workflows and thought it was interesting.
You are the one whom said you bought Xara Designer Pro after already having Pinegrow, hypocrite. 
So… .LMAO
…
@Pinegrow_User aka @Wappler_User 
mmm, Browser wont let me view site. says site is using and outdated insecure connection
and if you google the link and then check the Google Cached version its…less than spectacular.
@schpengle, not sure the link still works fine.
Hmmm … whelp this fun.
Had not expected to see the common “general tone of internet comments” present on the forum, enjoy the jesting and mockery. Interesting how fast the original thought was evaded and digressed however, since it seemed entirely pertinent regarding the topic of Dreamweaver. My mistake for thinking there could have been intelligent thoughtful conversation.
Oh Pahhleasee… You are being overly critical. We are just joking WITH you. Step back from the code and enjoy life. Not everything has to be so serious.
Let us know how that application works and if you like it or not.
I expected to have actual dialog about it, not youtube and twitter style comments. I also thought my initial pictograms should of indicated my intentions and thoughts regarding Pinegrow. 
Anyway I highly doubt it will rival Pinegrow features on first launch. It may be interesting however to see it progress, as they have a lot of existing Dreamweaver extensions they can roll into it from over the years. Like I said I am always interested in UI / UX and workflow, even just for evaluation purposes. We’ll see regarding cost, licensing and features overall, time will tell. I am not in need of further apps, but still like watching the industry and trying new app offerings.
The odd thing about this Wappler app though, is they claim its a component based visual workflow and “No coding required” yet still have what appears to be a code editor supporting everything + the kitchen sink. Rather odd the app features and early marketing are already so at odds with each other.
I just found it interesting and thought perhaps others would discus upon it also.
Their offerings have always been on the expensive side including adding nag screens in their DW extensions.
Looking at their current pricing structure I would make an assumption the cost is going to be rather steep unless you already are paying for their subscription service which is the only way to get their products.
Looking at their blog it seems they are actively developing and adding features to the pre-beta / beta. Already has very similar look to Pinegrow with quite a few features it has, at least from what I can tell from the blog posts.
Yeah its hard to tell concerning features and workflow at this point, not much to go by so far. But I guess the DMXzone Wappler folks must of saw a chance with disgruntled Adobe users and decided to leverage there extension base into an application. As they watched unhappy Dreamweaver users discuss its development and direction.
From what I have witnessed they already pissed off and made some potential users mad. Just based on how they have rolled out the private beta, promising a public beta prematurely and dragging their feet since, and falsely representing what features it has vs other apps. I suspect at some point things will get resolved and at least seem clearer to someone.
But I am afraid you are probably 100% right concerning price and licensing. $$$$$ + Cloud , will be hard to compete with Pinegrow regarding that aspect, which is great for Pinegrow. If they want to compete in the market space, or even just stick it to Adobe with taking Dreamweaver users, then they would be better off $ + Perpetual vs Dreamweaver and Adobe.
Web applications, really seem like the one app people are searching for regarding leaving Adobe and finding tools that meet their skills and requirements. With Affinity etc., the rest is already in place, you can find solutions for vectors, pixels, video, etc.
Obviously we are biased to Pinegrow and rightly so, coupled with Atom its already a powerhouse and getting better with every update.
Since everyone took the previous post so well and had so much fun with it.
It seems the self-proclaimed “Dreamweaver Killer”, Wappler has begun to reveal itself, both through their website and crowd-funding campaign efforts.
Looks like they are planning to have Wappler in 3 versions:
As outlined on this page regarding the extensions.
So far they made almost €2000 euros in about the first hour. With their crowd-funding campaign efforts.
Some more talk and discussion can be seen here in the comments about pricing, fees, updates, etc.
https://blog.wappler.io/lets-make-history-wappler-crowdfunding-is-launched/
There it says its based upon NWJS like Pinegrow.
It also sounds like it would be €399 ($500) for the pro version, which includes everything. Then a lower discounted annual fee each year to get updates and stay current. If that is the cost, then given the backend related stuff in the pro version, that may not be a bad cost for such a tool if someone wants a visual way to create dynamic database related sites and apps ?
The crowdfunding reminds me a lot of the (defunct / abandoned) Macaw and its Kickstarter, but its hard to say what the future fate of Wappler will be. Obviously they supposedly have a large current audience with their extensions, and a possible immediate crossover audience from Dreamweaver users, potentially.
Or similar to Macaw, perhaps an eventual buyout by Adobe, so it does not kill Dreamweaver as they claim ;–).
Wappler Intro from the The Dreamweaver Guru Joseph Lowery
The Properties Panel looks like Pinegrow 1 & 2.
Thank goodness for the new improved Pinegrow UI in version 3 and beyond !
Here are a few other articles, regarding this self-proclaimed Dreamweaver Killer.
So that seems like the existing new information. In case anyone wanted to read updates on the self-proclaimed “Dreamweaver Killer” , in your spare time.
PS: No I am not a backer, crowd funder, user, or anything else related to it. It was merely relative to this Dreamweaver thread as previously mentioned initially and is interesting, if nothing else.
Long live Pinegrow !
Totally agree with you. The only thing, thats interesting for me is the implementation of Framework 7. But 399,-€ a year is too much for me.